City of Chandler Planning and Zoning Meeting 6-07-23

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assistant
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Stephen Curry
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get my account
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probably be careful
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the 100.
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thank you
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episode
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good evening and welcome to the Planning
and Zoning commission regular meeting at
regular meeting for June 7th can I have
a roll call please
here ice
commissioner Morgan here commissioner
Quinn here commissioner Velasquez here
commissioner Barry kello here
commissioner Lopez here
thank you very much first next item is
the Pledge of Allegiance led by the Vice
chair
pledge allegiance
kitchen stands one nation under God
indivisible with liberty and justice for
all
thank you for that
okay
so I do have a few speaker a few cards
for items that are not part of the the
honey
cycle group so
um
on item number three
which is the Wayne I
um Ty Schumann do you wish to speak on
that item or you're just opposed to it
okay thank you okay
um
item number five
there's a question will that I have a
question from Dede I apologize for
butchering your last name here but
um will the change the Zoning for other
properties just east of the parcel and
Chandler Boulevard staff will you
address that
on number five
yes Mr chairman the request is to rezone
the subject's site only it will not
affect any surrounding properties okay
thank you very much
and then item number nine
Amos Vance I do not want more music in
the neighborhood
uh Amos do you want to speak on the item
or just want to State your opposition
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if you want to talk about if you want to
come up and state your name and address
for the record up on the dice right here
please
I'm here I think I'm representing the
neighborhood
the people in our neighborhood just
they think that they complain or stand
up for something that they may be going
against the city
so they depend on the city to make
decisions
I live about 30 feet and the perch
and music is loud enough there I have
foam on my bedroom on the walls and I
have your plugs
but having more music in the
neighborhood I don't think this is a
necessity
this
this entertainment uh permit is just
right next to the perch I don't know how
you'd have
such loud music right next to each other
for one
houses that cross the street and right
now on the next lot so I want you to
consider because I never did see the
site map and thought I'd see it on TV
so we don't want any more music in our
neighborhood
I appreciate it okay thank you thank you
staff for you addressed the question I
had earlier on the type of music
especially early in the morning on this
particular case
and he stated that the music that would
be playing um 10 a.m in the morning
would just be speakers which are a part
of this application so it would be um
speakers and it would not be
unreasonably loud to disturb
area residents okay
thank you
what do you mean by speakers it would be
music over the speakers and not live
bands what would what is meant by just
speakers somebody speaking no it would
just be music over the speakers not live
bands coming through the speakers at 10
am in the morning some more like just
CDs being played or background music
going on okay
cool thank you
okay I know we had additional
stipulation then on number
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number eight do you want to read that
into the record please yes so the
following condition of a pool will be
added to
um item number eight which is uh Crown
Chevron it's going to be uh condition
number five the application will work
with staff uh to provide additional
trees on site
okay thank you thank you
I want to address number nine for a
second
um to Mr Vance
um this couple different things that we
put in there
um into this there's a one-year time
step so if there is a problem there is
also a phone number for
um to be able to uh address it where you
can call but again it has a one-year
time step so if the applicant is not
being a good neighbor and the music's
above what's supposed to be you know
they're gonna have to come back here in
a year and in that case the permanent
might be be issued so I specifically
asked what type of music was going to be
played especially in the early mornings
and I hope these guys are going to be
good neighbors they you know the
restaurants are fairly successful
um it's part of our whole you know
downtown entertainment area but I do
hear you and I think they they need to
be aware of that that they're trying not
to disturb the neighbors that's why I
was questioning early morning music
um in terms of that as well and stuff so
um
to the audience we have a study session
prior to this where we've discussed
items one through
10.
um is there anybody in the audience
other than the cards that I got that
want to talk on any of those items
okay see none okay what's the council
I'm sorry commission's pleasure
sure
I'll move to approve the consent agenda
with the additional conditions number
five to item eight okay
okay I'm not sure who got the second but
staffy Julia which one
okay we'll give it to you we'll give it
to the new Visa yeah so anyway okay
any further discussion
all those in favor of the motion say aye
aye
aye closed motion carries unanimously
okay thank you very much
all right the next item is item number
11.
uh staff do you want to make a
presentation for the audience what we'll
do is Staff will make a presentation
we'll go to the applicant to make their
presentation and then I'll go to the
speaker cards
if anybody besides what I have up here
if there's anybody who'd like us to
speak please fill out a speaker card and
give it to our Clerk
Lauren you're up
good evening Planning and Zoning
Commissioners
tonight on your action agenda we have
item 11 plh 2218 and PLT 2217
honeysuckle Trail
the request before you this evening
there's there's a couple of requests as
part of this request so I'm going to
walk you through it a couple of times
through this PowerPoint but the request
before you is a rezoning from sf33
single family to planned area
development for single family
residential and a city park
a preliminary development plan for
subdivision layout and housing product
as well as a preliminary plant for a 48
lot single-family subdivision in city
park with retention
the subject site is located
at the North West corner of Warner and
bull moose it's approximately a quarter
of a mile from Dobson and Warner
the subject site uh fronts onto Warner
Road
and an existing church or a dilapidated
Church exist on site with existing
retention along the north side of the
property
to the east of the subject site is a
collector Street Bull Moose drive and
east of that is a single family
subdivision zoned SF 8.5
the Orange Tree Subdivision of lots
averaging 7 000 square foot Lots to the
north we have El Alba Way
and
single-family Zone properties sf-18
and then to the west of the property all
of that land is unincorporated and
currently located within Maricopa County
along Warner Road at the South West
corner of the the of the proposed site
there is a school the foundation for the
School for the Blind there's two
single-family homes that are zoned uh
rural agrarian within the county
uh and then we have a a city operated
Water Production facility as well as a
additional
unincorporated
rural Residential Properties north of
that
to give you a little bit of background
on the property
the subject property located on the left
side of the screen was annexed into the
city in 1979.
it was zoned with the property indicated
in the blue with the larger subdivision
around
the proposed property was zoned sf-33
which would allow for one single family
home per a lot minimum lot size would be
33 000 square feet
the properties to the east were given a
zoning of sf7 which were single family
homes that average 7 000 square feet and
north of the property those lots were
given sf-18 it was one zoning case with
the three different land classifications
in that case there was a preliminary
plot that or there was a plot that was
established
and the north side of this property was
identified as a track for retention it
was privately owned but it was retention
for the entire subdivision to the east
at that time the property was uh
owned by a church
a year later in 1980 because a church
isn't permitted by right on an sf-33
property they acquired a use permit to
allow for a church so the picture on the
right side of the screen uh is from 1986
so you can see you know
seven years after being being annexed
you can see the subdivision filled in
and developed with the church developing
as well in the circle you'll see the
church with the north side of the
property being used as retention
the church has operated for for decades
but at one point the pastor became ill
and at that time from what we understand
the retention Basin was not being
maintained and so it was building up
into the areas
fast forward to 2014 September 2014
there was a large storm that occurred
here in Chandler
the picture in front of you shows you uh
standing in or standing on the north
side of the Basin looking East into the
community water inundated the retention
Basin going up over the street and onto
the single family driveways just
reaching their garage doors
retention basins are required to hold
a hundred year two hour storm and if I
understand that correctly it's 2.2
inches this storm dropped about three
times that amount and being not built to
current standards and not being
maintained throughout the years it
flooded the entire neighborhood as part
of my packet that was sent to you one of
the attachments one of the neighbors
provided a packet of pictures from many
angles throughout that neighborhood
fast forward even more we get to 2018.
there's a home builder New Village Homes
they submitted a zoning application to
rezone the property to allow for 57
single-family homes they were going to
keep the retention Basin as the city at
the time said they had no desire to
maintain or take over responsibility of
the of the basin
under this proposal there was going to
be private amenities in between the
subdivision and the retention basin
we later found out in reviewing the
plans that at that time the the
calculations were Incorrect and it
wouldn't be able to suffice the correct
amount of retention required and due to
the amount of opposition the case was
withdrawn in July of 2019.
so we come before you today with a
request
the request before you is a rezoning to
rezone the property from sf-33 to
planned area development for a
single-family residential and a city
park
there's an Associated preliminary
development plan for a subdivision
layout and includes the housing product
for the subdivision
as well as a preliminary plot for the 48
lot single-family subdivision and city
park with retention
I'm going to break this up into two
portions we're going to talk about the
subdivision and then we'll move north to
the park
so on the south
[Music]
kahov is a homebuilder here in the
valley and they are proposing to rezone
the property to planned area development
for single-family homes they're
proposing 48 Lots within eight Acres
that those acres are only outlined in
green they were unable to use any of the
Acres from the park or the retention
Basin to the north to equate towards
their density so with those eight acres
and the 48 single family lots they're
coming in at eight units per acre
the standard lot sizes are 4 000 to
6859 square feet the smallest lot is 40
by 100 feet
the subdivision is providing public
streets within the subdivision which
would allow for parking on both sides of
the street
traffic has reviewed this plan as well
as fire and you know have signed off on
the design of it
each property or each home pardon me
will have a two-car garage as well as a
driveway to allow for two vehicles to
park
all of the 48 homes being proposed are
two-story with a maximum height of 30
feet
the perimeter wall along Warner Road
varies and at some points it's 10 feet
but at certain points it meanders from
10 to 15 feet and at the southwest
corner it gets as deep as 58 feet to
allow for plantings of trees out along
Warner Road and to break up the wall
Lauren I don't interrupt but you want to
clarify something you talked about the
eight Acres only can include where the
homes are in a normal development where
the open space would be included as part
of the density correct that is correct
chair so if you throw that in it would
be a lot less than six per acre but
because it's being deeded to the city or
there's a development agreement that
changes why the density seems to be high
okay I just want to clarify that
as part of this request there's a
preliminary development plan for housing
product
the home builder is providing four
separate floor plans with three
architectural themes including Spanish
Spanish modern Farmhouse and
contemporary the homes being proposed
are range from
1979 square feet to
2640 square foot
the building setbacks for these homes on
each individual lot the front setback
would be 20 feet from back a sidewalk to
front of the garage to allow for
vehicles to park and not overhang the
sidewalk
and then 13 feet in the front for any
livable or front patios
side yards for this they would be
required to maintain five feet on each
side of the home
and rear yard setbacks are 10 feet with
the ability to reduce that setback to
five feet for any accessory buildings
now moving to the north
the request is to rezone this property
from sf-33 to pad for a city park with
retention
there was a preliminary development plan
submitted and it has been evaluated by
City engineers and we can confirm that
the Basin can retain that Acquire the
required volume calculations
between the park and the retention Basin
it's totaling approximately 4.5 Acres
now let me break that down for you
so on the south portion of it which
would be between the subdivision and the
retention basin the home builders is
providing they're going out there and
re-grading the entire site to
accommodate retention for all
surrounding properties including theirs
and they plan on building a park the
park will be 1.7 Acres large and it will
include a Tot Lot a shaded Ramada with
seating and a barbecue area
uh it will be turf
with sidewalks leading down into the
area
north of that in order to get a usable
public park open to the public
the retention Basin had to be uh
deep in order to accumulate all that
water
so the retention Basin is 2.8 Acres
large and it's secured with view fencing
due to the depth of it it's proposed at
five feet Maricopa County requires
anything over 3.4 feet deep to be
secured because it could pool
upon completion the city will own and
maintain both the retention Basin and
the park this is being processed through
a development agreement which would be
heard before city council
um
as well with the zoning case it's tied
to the zoning case
one of the residents years ago brought
it to my attention that in this area
there's no park within their square mile
this exhibit is taken from our existing
city parks within our general plan the
circle is the square mile between Warner
to Elliott from Dobson to price in this
area there's no no public park for the
neighbors to attend
foreign
so as for neighborhood Outreach you know
one of the reasons we requested this
Beyond action is we've heard a lot from
residents in the surrounding
neighborhood they had uh they were only
required to have one neighborhood
meeting but due to the amount of
attendees from the first we requested
that a second neighborhood meeting be
held the first was held in on January
10th and the second April 12th of this
year
the notification was posted on Nextdoor
app as well as posted on site uh two
weeks prior to the meeting
then the applicant actually went out of
their way to actually notify and invite
all of the residents of orange tree when
you look at the exhibit on on on the
screen
the zoning code code only requires that
residents with property owners within
600 feet of The Proposal be notified of
any neighborhood meetings the applicant
and homebuilder went out and invited
everybody from orange tree and so both
meetings were well attended standing
room only
um
as of today staff is aware of opposition
to the request as well as support to
clean up the property
neighborhood minutes meeting minutes
were attached as an exhibit so you could
understand some of the questions that
were asked
but what we hear is an increase in
traffic from the 48 lots and then
residents wanting to drive to the park
the exhibit before you shows the
proposed subdivision in park in its
proposed location and we've heard
concerns about the intersection of bull
moose and Warner
um
after talking with our city traffic
engineer you know there was a traffic
study done one year ago and there were
numbers the numbers did not warrant a
traffic signal further and more when we
look at this exhibit there's a blue
square
that's bull moose on the other side
because they were built offset it makes
uh it it does not set up a good um
it's it's not a good area to set up a
traffic signal because of the offset of
bull moose and the median turn lane
residents were concerned with the amount
of traffic I've circled all of the exits
from the subdivision the purple hatched
area on this exhibit are County Islands
we've heard from a lot of County County
Island residents the concern of
residents from this proposal going
through their subdivision to get to
Elliott
um other concerns that we've heard is
you know the the request for two-story
product
the property the subdivision adjacent
it's zoned SF 8.5 although there are no
two-story homes in that subdivision they
do have the ability to increase to a
two-story as permitted by right in their
zoning
we've we've heard that it is too dense
when we look at the proposal it's in
compliance with our general plan as it
sits along an arterial
this is a true infill development it
sits between two different intensities
of you know rural large acre lots to
homes that are approximately
averaging 7 000 square foot Lots
um it's in close proximity to a highway
and
you know staff feels that it is a
compatible land use as designed the
other concern we've heard uh the yellow
line indicated on here is an irrigation
ditch located within the county
properties and just wondering how that
would be maintained from
um from what we understand in the
exhibits provided to the city it seems
that that ditch is completely within the
Maricopa County Properties
so as I was citing our general plan
designates this site as neighborhoods
which staff does find to be in
compliance this request with the general
plan as a infill development in between
different intensities it's located along
an arterial within a half mile of a
freeway it provides a variety of housing
within the neighborhood and it's a
compatible land use
it provides a park for the surrounding
neighborhoods within that square mile
and it resolves a retention issue for
the for the region
staff has provided standard stipulations
as well a couple of stipulation PDP
stipulation number 10 was also included
as requested by a resident stating that
Lots 1 in 42 which are the lots
immediately adjacent to Bull Moose be
limited to the two smaller floor plans
as to you know since they are closer
those two side homes are closer than any
of the others to help create a better
buffer for the existing community
and with that staff recommends approval
and I'd be happy to answer any questions
Lauren did you work there was a
stipulation I talked about in the
pre-meeting about articulation along
Warner do you work up a step on that
chair human I was able to follow up with
the applicant and so the way that the
step is currently written we have a step
that says PDP step number two that the
same elevation should not be built side
by side or directly across the street
they've agreed to add an additional
stipulation that would limit Lots one
through eight from being the same
elevation and or floor plan
um for Lots one through eight which back
up to Warner Road so if this gets
approved tonight and goes to council at
least there's some articulation there
okay thank you
Lauren can you answer a question on a
land use
if a charter school bought this land
by right could they just come in without
the city really having any control over
it chair human uh if the charter school
was publicly funded they would not be
required to meet any of the city city
standards with regards to zoning they
would just have to meet life safety and
fire they're not even required to meet
traffic standards and so if a publicly
funded charter school was to acquire
this property
um you know they they could go and buy
right and possibly secure that retention
Basin and fence it off because schools
generally don't allow
non-school users to be on site and if
another church wanted to buy this sites
since it already has a church on there
could that just be done without any
other than maybe a PVP for the city
well it would probably need a new use
permit just to ensure because it's not
permitted by right under an sf33 but a
use permit would possibly be required if
not like for like
questions of Staff Jeff
thank you Lauren I have four questions
actually fire them off at you um can you
go back to the
the previous slide I think it was
resident concerns slide yeah
neighborhood concerns number one
question is there currently a traffic
signal at Mesquite at Dobson
uh through the chair commissioner
Vasquez no it's only a stop sign Dobson
is uh there's no stop sign there no
signal just a stop sign at Mesquite okay
second question are all of the product
two-story
that is correct all of it is two-story
thank you third question
um
are there existing dry wells in the the
fenced off proposed Basin to the north
through their engineered drywalls in
their existing or proposed with this
development to drain within 36 hours
okay
through through the chair commissioner
Vasquez um there's two art knowledge I
don't believe there's any in there today
with the request before you there are no
um and I'll confirm with the applicant
maybe when they come up but I I believe
that they're not requesting
drywalls
to be undergrounded okay and then the
last question
um at the 1.7 acre park is there any
retention other than just sidewalks
within the park going to that Park site
the improved Park
or is it all going to the northern basin
um
chair uh through the chair commissioner
vasque is a great question so the
exhibit before you you know you'll see
that green line so a portion of the
subdivision retains along Bull Moose
within that green area
and then a little bit spills over which
the city Engineers signed off on but
everything in the park would drain
towards the retention Basin okay thank
you
and to add on that a portion of the
subdivisions retention would flow
towards Warner in that southwest corner
stock pass yeah so the uh the new
retention Basin talking about having to
go down to the uh was it an additional
two and a half feet or two two and a
half feet down jobs it's a total of five
feet deep so yeah okay so probably
additional two and a half
um and that is a bird even though it has
to be fenced it's a bird
retention Basin I'm assuming it's not a
wall to drop off
is that correct
did you understand running commissioner
Lopez uh can you explain bird as in it's
it's a it's
b-e-r-m burned thank you
um yes um there will be berms out along
um if you
Park plan oh
yeah so in this plan
um you see that they're actually they're
keeping some of the trees they're
keeping some of those mature trees
they're adding some trees out along Bull
Moose there and then they will have some
birming in order to try to break up
those views and and as part of that the
new calculations because I mean the way
it was before
uh bigger but not as deep was not
designed correctly or was it just not
designed for the Thousand Year flood
that we got and the new one is what are
the design standards for that one to
what volume great question uh I believe
from the time it was designed in 1978
1979 uh our standards have changed since
okay and the new that calculation is it
still based on a hundred year flood or
100 Year rain or a different okay so
still saying just a different
calculation okay thank you other
questions
Lauren and the diagram you have here
it appears that the park is still also a
basin is that just a leftover
um drawing but there appears to be
topography lines that would indicate
that the turf area in the park is also a
retention area
through the chair commissioner Quinn uh
of course it is more of a little a basin
for the turf area it will retain some
water but it's not taking on a majority
of the water
it does appear to be
three feet deep chairman if I could jump
in real quick so the entire city parcel
effectively retains water anything
deeper than 3.49 feet deep needs to be
fenced off from Maricopa County so the
uh the park side of the of the city
parcel to be owned will be that that
depth that doesn't require fencing but
it will be a basin so it the 100 year
two hour event storm the retention Basin
will be full and the water will fill up
above that and then go over all the way
to the uh to the city park normal storms
will all go to the retention Basin and
not keep the parking needed but the
whole thing serves as a basin so that
means the
roughly that's between 28 and 30 acre
feet of water storage yep it's a lot
yeah okay thank you the exception that
the Tot Lot will be high and dry up for
code
okay
um Mr chair just one question excuse me
as it relates to the overall Ambitions
of water conservation just curious on
the amount of turf shown there since
this isn't likely to be an activated
park with soccer fields and all those
other things just curious on
um the immense amount of turf there and
if there was any thoughts on reducing
that just out of curiosity
through the chair uh commissioner
um there were a lot of conversations had
we've been looking at this for over a
year there's been discussions with our
parks department
um civil Trump it's been an ongoing
conversation
at one point it was said to just DG the
entire thing but the the Tot Lot but I
who would really want to use that would
you feel comfortable walking a dog in it
letting your child play in it so we
expected that a portion of it be turfed
okay
I think that the new buzzwords are
functional versus non-functional this
would still this will be functional Turf
versus just being our
decorative any other questions
okay if the applicant would like to come
up state your name and address to the
record sir and
this one oh okay yeah yeah
there we go there
yeah
that's it
good evening Mr chairman members of the
commission my name is Ralph Pugh My
office address is in Mesa it's a
pleasure to be here this afternoon on
behalf of K hobnanian homes and with me
here today is Mr Chuck Chisholm and also
Francisco Castell from K hobnanian uh
members of the commission this has been
a long and arduous task to bring this
parcel to you today you are seeing the
tip of the proverbial iceberg in the
best description possible
a full two years has taken to get to
this point and many thanks to the staff
let me just say that we've had
practically every discipline at the city
and every Department involved in one way
or another in this particular plan and
how it could be rehabilitated and how it
can work today so thank you to not only
your planning and Engineering but other
departments the legal department and
everybody has been great to work with to
get this to this point today so I
certainly don't intend to reiterate
everything that Ms Schumann had to say
today her her presentation was
comprehensive and complete let me just
highlight a few things that I heard from
commissioners before I forget them with
respect to the density if you take the
48 Lots into 12 full Acres we would be
at four units to the acre I think that
was a question or comment that one of
you had made earlier if you do the math
that's what it really amounts to
the other thing having to do with the
development agreement we are working
with the city's attorney's office and
appreciate their help that will be
reviewed and looked at by the city
council in conjunction with this case
and that document will Define all the
parameters within which the retention
Basin gets built the Park area gets
built when and how does that land get
conveyed and transferred to the city all
that technical business is handled in
that development agreement there are and
will be planned for this project dry
Wells clearly to make the retention
Basin uh function and with respect to
Turf commissioner uh the main Basin
that's five feet deep and that is
protected with the fence will not have
turf in the bottom of it it will be a
very uh functional for lack of a better
word Basin but the other portion of the
park will have turf for the playground
area
so what caused the confusion someone
else asked that question how did we get
to this point right this is a highly
unusual spot to be in it all started in
1978
with an ambiguous language a paragraph
in a plat for the Orange Tree
Subdivision and what responsibility lied
where with respect to retention
that situation just existed and I can't
take the fault for it I started
practicing law in 1979 so this was done
at about that time but I didn't do it I
don't know who did and nobody in
Chandler frankly none of the staff had
anything to do with it so we're living
today with what happened then and we're
trying to structure it in a way that
works now so the benefits to the city
are clearly as follows one a retention
Basin that's designed to be utilitarian
five feet deep protected with fencing to
serve the neighborhood and the community
so we don't have what happened in 2014.
that's number one to the city and we
would hope to hear from our neighbors
that it's important to them right and so
this the second item here
is not only that but now a public park
so just slightly less than two acres of
this land will indeed be a public park
with amenities fully accessible to
members of the community that's the
second major benefit then we also have
here an unoccupied structure with
unattended to Landscaping
both of those issues combine to not
create a very pleasant spot
so we're going to rehabilitate that at
our expense and then convey it to the
city so those are things you just don't
see in projects and most projects don't
have to deal with coming in on a pure
infill I mean Lauren hit it right on the
head describing infield this is a
picture-perfect example of that
um the other thing I think is important
to note that this has a full
recommendation from the staff coming to
you for approval we've done a lot in
reaching out to the neighborhood two
neighborhood meetings and admittedly in
both meetings there were pros and cons
but we did reach out and I think you'll
hear probably from both sides of that
issue here this evening the other thing
to keep in mind is that this is bringing
to the area a new design subdivision
with fresh Landscaping the streets are
City standard you can park on both sides
of the street two car garages parking in
the driveway this is a real subdivision
it's admittedly on lots that are smaller
than our neighbors but when you take the
density as a whole and could factor into
the land that's being deeded to the city
it gets to be pretty close to the same
questions have come up that have been
answered by the staff with respect to
traffic your traffic department along
with our traffic uh study has indicated
that these 48 homes are not going to
move the dial on any additional traffic
congestion or need I should say need to
rehabilitate or improve roadways and
traffic signals can't go here on Warner
for the reasons mentioned by staff
parking people were concerned about
parking I've already explained there's
plenty of parking on the site on the
streets in the driveways in the garages
Landscaping fresh new Landscaping will
agree and did tell the neighbors that we
would not allow our construction trucks
during construction to come through the
County Properties to our West so you may
hear from folks that live in the county
this evening we've agreed to that and we
also understand and came to the
conclusion the other night in a
neighborhood meeting this project will
not touch interfere with or do anything
with the irrigation system that lies to
the the owners to our West so we don't
want to touch that or
impede the delivery of that water in any
way so again thank you to everyone for
the hard work getting here today we urge
your recommendation of approval we agree
with all the stipulations and conditions
including the one that was just added in
the presentation from the staff so with
that Mr chairman I'll be quite unless
there are any questions
Commissioners have questions of the
applicant
okay thank you Mr Pew I could reserve a
moment for rebuttal absolutely
absolutely thank you absolutely thank
you
okay so we're
calling the speakers these are no
particular order than the way they came
to me from staff
um Michael Barron
uh wish to speak on the item
Michael Bear if you can come up state
your name and address to the record
please you have three minutes the light
will start with green it'll go to yellow
with about 30 seconds ago and then red
you just need to finish up please so
good evening my name is Michael Barron
my wife Karen and I own property
directly across the street on Baltimore
and we are here to say that we fully
support the project we uh have seen the
other project that came forward and we
were hopeful then and this is a far
superior project we we're both full-time
real estate agents we know K hoopnanians
product or
familiar with the the Builder we have no
affiliation with them we just
wholeheartedly endorse this we we had
water actually come up within about
eight feet of the front door of our
property on that event happened we've
owned the property of about 11 years I
believe
but um we're looking forward to it it's
um an eyesore and we appreciate there's
one of the neighbors Dwayne lidman I
don't know if Dwayne is here but he's a
gentleman who lives in Orange Tree who's
done an enormous amount of work with the
city trying to get a park for the
neighborhood there's no park at all and
so thank you to the city the staff the
developer everyone we're just we're
looking forward to it it'll be much
prettier too
so thank you yeah thank you very much
okay thank you any questions for the
speakers
thank you
appreciate it
okay
um Valerie
looks like milkov does not want to speak
but
um is an opposition of the project
prefer something other than
gravel and the retention basin
one of the landscape with plant life so
um staff could you address the the
retention area the big one is just going
to be graveled they'll be Landscaping on
the street or not
Lauren
chair human uh yes there'll be some
shade trees up along the street
but as for the bottom of the Basin
there's no plans yet but the longest
streetscape when you're driving down
you'll be it'll be landscape great thank
you okay
okay next person
Roy Pinkerton
uh wish to speak on the item if you come
up and state your name and address for
the record
you come up to the dice state your name
and address for the record Mr Pinkerton
and
you have three minutes
good evening my name is
with 1918 North Bull Moose Drive
I'm opposed to the project
for two reasons
one is the traffic it's not just gonna
affect little moose and Warner it's
going to affect Alice and Coronado
they won't be able to get out to the
freeway
that be lines backed up
that's just one thing the study was
taken on their traffic
I don't know two years ago or three
since that time we've had triple the
traffic on one
they need to look at that again real
hard
we voted down not having a traffic light
there before we sure don't want one
again
the other reason
it's kind of dear to my heart I'm third
generation water well driller in this
state
I've seen water go from 35 feet deep to
55 feet deep
if you don't stop building these condos
and apartments and houses you're gonna
run out of water
period
that's all I got to say any questions
any questions thank you sir I appreciate
your coming up
okay next speaker Scott
sorry I can't pronounce the last name so
it starts with an M cool if you can come
up to the diet state your name and
address of the record
hi my name is Scott Mullins I live at
2317 West Mesquite Street
I do oppose this project on a number of
reasons
um
one that's already been touched on is
traffic there is going to be a problem
at Bull Moose and Warner because like
they said Bull Moose is offset when it
hits Warner and staggered so you can't
put a light there or anything like that
um
right now there's delays getting in and
out of that particular intersection
anyway of bull moose and Warner
um
it's going to be even more backed up
with the uh high density of the property
that's going in right now
um
the numbers that have been mentioned for
the density
don't quite seem right
um
the least dense
you're good the least dense uh area of
orange tree right now has 1400 square
foot houses on 7 000 square feet of land
these houses that are being proposed are
going to be 50 percent larger than that
on a lot that's four thousand square
feet
it's it's a lot higher density it
doesn't really fit in with the plan of
orange tree in general
um plus there aren't any two-story
buildings in orange tree
and I don't really see that anybody's
going to build a second floor Edition on
there
um
and parking as far as parking is
concerned I know they offer two-car
garage and spaces
in the driveway for two more cars
but
they basically said that they're gonna
make sure that everyone parks in their
garage and I don't know that you can
really
enforce that
and it doesn't seem like there's going
to be adequate parking for it and when
they were going through the plans in
previous meetings
it didn't seem like they were really the
streets were wide enough to even park on
the the street in front of your house
really and have like an emergency
vehicle be able to make it through
so I do oppose this
and if you have any questions uh
question Mr Mullins staff here you want
to address the the parking on the street
and the fire I mean our traffic
department or Engineers have already
looked at this correct
uh chair human that is correct we do
have a standard detail for Water Street
would look like to allow for parking on
both sides one side no side and per the
exhibit provided and per the plans
submitted under the preliminary plot it
showed that parking was permitted on
both sides of Road and we wouldn't allow
anything to be built unless it could
have a fire truck go through things like
that correct that is correct thank you
thank you sir appreciate it thank you
next speaker is Brian Campanella
you want to come up and state your name
and address for the record
hi Brian Campanella 2100 block of
Mariposa it's a real short road well
completely opposed to this whole thing
basically in my opinion
the city has been colluding
with a non-constituent
to change something without telling the
public as we just learned for two years
unacceptable
the city council needs to
Zone everything
get rid of this whole working with
developers thing and have a plan check
build to what the property is zoned to
plan check it and then approve it
you obviously have a relationship with
the attorney from Pew law because when
he walked in he had a little joke with
each other
another indication of what I consider to
be collusion
with a non-constituent
and if even one constituent opposes this
it should not go through
also
Rick and I'm not trying to beat you up
here
but trying to add in well really if you
consider all of the property the density
is not that high well they're not
allowed to consider that property for
their density so why did you bring that
up
again another indication that we have
this relationship with a non-constituent
okay and it's very obvious that this is
going to get pushed through
okay it's wrong
it doesn't com it doesn't fit with the
neighborhood
it's I believe in free enterprise and
and uh
uh except there's no such thing in
America anymore because of all the
regulations
but capitalism is a wonderful thing
but not at the expense of this
neighborhood the only reason that the
number is 48 is because that's the
absolute
largest number they can squeeze in here
okay if
if you change the zoning
the other thing is when we showed the uh
the page with all the parks around here
we didn't show the size of the park that
this is going to have
you know why because it's minuscule the
original Park
for the orange tree was supposed to be
that whole area the other thing nobody
seems to understand is I have seen that
property irrigated
so that Canal is also
property of the landowner and to abandon
it you have to put it back into
full use or you know if it can't have
any cracks and breaks in it that's the
responsibility of the people who abandon
it
which would be okay Hove
so this just this whole thing just
disgusts me sir could you wrap up your
statement please why because it's
uncomfortable no because you have three
minutes or three minutes huh okay well
it's an absolute ridiculous number of
homes and it is the density that it is
and the park should have been the whole
event the whole basin
and now we get this little minuscule one
that we didn't put on the map because
it's going to show how small it is
relative to the other
parks that we so uh proudly showed
that's it I mean I go on forever but
thank you sir sir I'm just going to
address one thing
accusing me of conclusion with an
attorney I've been on this diet for many
years and most learning attorneys will
tell you that I put against a lot of
their projects and I voted for some of
the projects so I appreciate your
comments in terms of density things like
that but to accuse this diet or myself
of conclusion I think is very irrelevant
so yeah
okay the next speaker I have is Denise
Campanella if you want to state your
name and address for the record
hi my name is Denise Campanella and I'm
a resident of the orange tree
neighborhood
um
I am
uh in favor of this uh
cleaning up of this property I'm just
not in favor of the density that is
proposed in changing the zoning
you've got 48 homes that you've
identified that have the potential of
having as many as four of their own cars
these are big big homes for families
that have more than one car two cars
all of them have to leave this
subdivision off of bull moose
due to opposition there originally was
only one exit onto Bull Moose which is
only approximately two car lengths
before you hit Warner the first exit
the second exit now has been opened up
uh for more cars to come out you know to
be able to exit the development
the density along Warner Road in the
early mornings when people are going to
work
um I used to take that route to go to
work I went I left my home just
depending on what my schedule was for
the day anytime between 5 a.m and 8
o'clock
and I can tell you that there were times
that I would have to sit for almost five
minutes waiting for the traffic to come
down Warner and I have seen the traffic
to get onto the 101 backed up as far as
the school for the deaf okay which is
the the develop the building to the west
of this property in in the early morning
so all that traffic
tonight because I was here for the early
part of the meeting we learned that
there is a another potential pad
development one quarter mile south of
Warner and Dobson with a hundred I
thought maybe it was 110 properties any
of those people are going to come the
quarter of a mile up to the turn at
Warner and to come on over to the uh 101
as well so the density along Warner is
going to be incredible between the 48
homes here and the 110 that are just one
quarter mile south of uh Warner that is
that is my concern I drove down Bull
Moose today Bull Moose is 25 mile an
hour
uh speed limit on on bull moves the
person behind me was in my trunk and I
glanced at my speed speedometer and I
was going 28 miles an hour and he was
trying to push me down the street we had
a horrible accident at the corner of El
Alba and bull moose because somebody was
speeding
injuries in the whole thing that's in
the middle of the neighborhood
so we already have a problem with
speeding along Bull Moose with this all
this additional traffic
um it I I think it's untenable for the
neighborhood
okay if you can wrap up please thank you
and that's what I have to say thank you
for your comments I appreciate it you're
welcome
okay
Nicholas
Wist
at least okay thank you
state your name and address for the
record be great okay uh my name is
Nicholas Wiest I live at 2212 West Los
Arboles place and uh well I we moved
there in 1983 so we're original people
over there at uh orange three one I'd
just like to speak to the quality of the
homes I work for a company that
um surveys new developments in the East
Valley
um ASA at Gilbert Chandler and
um in the capacity of what I've done
I've surveyed of all the builders Sultan
um polti all those guys and and hovenian
uh kahoe and their products are always
really really good and neighborhoods are
great
the houses look great and so I'm just
here to just say that I've really been
impressed with their product I have no
association with those tags other than
just that I uh
surveyed all these properties all over
the place uh thank you thank you Mr any
questions thank you sir appreciate it
you're welcome
okay Kenneth Marx
we can state your name and address for
the record
my name is Kenneth marks 2533 West El
Alba Way uh I'm in the county portion of
it and uh there were two things I wanted
to talk about I started off wanting to
talk about traffic only but the issue
I'm glad the commissioner brought up the
issue of the dry Wells because that
points out something too the retention
Basin not only has to be of a size to
contain the water during a certain storm
but it has to get rid of it in a certain
period of time too and that's what the
drywalls are for so hopefully the city
will keep an eye on that sort of thing
so that we don't have a big Mosquito
Lake there like we have had in the past
it's amazing how many can breed in there
in a very short length of time
my other issue is uh traffic
on El Alba Let's see we don't really
have a map to point to maybe you have a
map you can look at there El Alba is uh
an East-West Street uh which is the
first street you would come to on the
west side of uh
uh Bull Moose as you're going north from
uh Warner and uh that
whole street there and uh it dead ends
into 91st which then turns South and
gets on to Warner and we have a certain
amount of cut through traffic now
because bull moose that intersection of
bull moose and Warner like so many
people have said is a tough intersection
there
and if people find it difficult to get
in and out there they like to go up 91st
and cut down El Alba
so in a nutshell that's my concern that
we get shortcutting traffic coming
through there
if that intersection of bull moose gets
worse which I believe it will
and uh uh in terms of the development
itself uh I think the applicants uh have
good reputations I think they've been
around a while I think they've been
responsive to the uh questions that
we've had and I don't have any problem
with that but they're these two issues
are issues that I uh would appreciate
you folks looking at okay thank you
thank you
um to staff L Alva once the subdivision
is built we'll allow we'll go through
anymore or
Lauren can you address that
you're human
say it three times fast
uh chair human uh elbow way is the
street directly north of the retention
Basin
um the so
so I was just curious that's that's just
nor it's not part of this project really
it's north of it okay it's the street
directly north of what's going to be the
retention basis okay I just want to
clarify and the drywalls I think that's
already been addressed by
by you guys the staff so okay thank you
sir appreciate you coming
for the plans being reviewed uh they're
required to drain within 36 hours
all right
um and hopefully we'll never have
another five and a half inches in two
hours like we did
um Vicki marks
you want to come up and state your name
and address for the record
good evening my name is Vicki marks I
live at on L Alba also and uh that is a
County area and and so it is a difficult
area to to try to assimilate with the
city
my concern is basically
um the retention the wall along the
whole project
on the west side
we have our irrigation dishes that come
down
we have some traffic on them now of
people that shouldn't be there not many
and I am concerned that there will not I
would like to know if there's going to
be enough interest in a wall high enough
that we don't have people from the park
we don't have people from the other area
coming over into our area
we're beginning to not us but this the
church has begun to have some
um campers there
and I don't want them to be more
interested in coming down those canals
we also have animals we have chickens
stolen we have a lot of issues with
people coming over so the project is
probably going to be okay I am also
concerned about traffic but
it's just going to have to work out
somehow we're worried about El Abba
because it's a very small street with
wise we have a lot of joggers a lot of
kids a lot of people riding horses up
and down the street so we would and
that's early in the morning they do that
so we're a little concerned about
the problems that will ensue from people
wanting to come down al-aba go across go
out 91st or come in
so that's just my concerns I hope the
developer will also get back to us on a
wall there because we don't want to be
liable for people falling in the ditch
or climbing over a five foot high fence
into the dish
so thank you for your consideration on
this so let me ask staff Laura in terms
of the irrigation ditch or in terms of
the wall and stuff and the irrigation
just we're not blocking that because
it's still a functioning dish the dish
just not a problem okay it's
it's it's mainly on the homeowner's
concern okay and we just don't want
people from this side coming over in to
all this property and possibly cause it
problems because right now so it's out
like can't they do it right now it's
open now isn't it it has about a five
foot high fence
chicken wire fence to dress the campers
just you know we have a department in
our city that you have that situation
come up feel free to call
um it's Leah Powell's office I don't
know the phone number or anything but
staff can get that for you so when you
do have that we do have issues around
the city where where I live on the west
side so but staff may even get you that
number too so if you do have that happen
please feel free to call the staff so
they can deal with that stuff for you
thank you okay
is there anybody else in the audience
that's all the speaker cards I have
anybody else in the audience want to
address this issue
okay I have somebody in the back there
if you want to come up and state your
name and address for the record it'd be
great
and make sure I don't miss anybody
hi my name is Noel Coates I live on
Marlborough Estates off 91st so I'm just
south of Elliott
um north of the property you're talking
about
um just a couple things that came up we
are prop we are in County property so
our property has
um backed up to the new development
that's on price I don't know if you know
it's a rental department development
that you guys approved couple years ago
that's finally completed lots of water
used to build homes we were amazed at
how much water is used to to build homes
to address the the water issue that came
up
um we are concerned about traffic on
91st because
already people from south of us across
91st that live south of Mesquite
come through our neighborhood they don't
follow the speed limit a lot of there's
no sidewalks so if you're walking riding
your bike your kids are out there's no
um there you really have to pay
attention and some people don't
um because we've dealt with this
property that's being built they don't
take care of the ditch I believe they're
supposed to when they were building that
property they're the diggers the heavy
equipment came right up to the ditch
they didn't pay attention there's a lot
of cracks in it and now it's all over
ground and I'm a matter of fact I'm
totally surprised that the city of
Chandler hasn't notified the residents
in that area that the ditch needs to be
taken care of because
um we've got we've we've got the that
part new property and then the condo
property and then the the
um nursing home that are there so none
of them use the ditch so it's all the
responsibility of those of us in the in
the county property to make maintain the
ditches and make sure and that the water
flow is is good and and we get no help
or assistance from that side
um and then there was one more thing
um
the ditch oh the fire trucks if you I do
you guys go and look at these properties
before before you have these meetings
there's no way a fire truck can go down
that that road
that of of the um that new property that
they built it is so narrow
so they what they did is they built an
uh an entrance that's locked to the
condo that's just south of them so that
if there is an emergency that they will
um they'll go through the condos to get
to that street because you can barely
drive down that street and we have
friends in Marble
um a state which is like which is the
pro the neighborhood on sorry I know
neighborhood on that's on price and
Elliott the corner there and so now
people from that new development are
parking in their neighborhood because
there isn't enough parking on that
street so those are just some of the
issues that we might encounter with this
new Department thank you
thank you
um to staff on a couple things ma'am on
the on the water on the just so you're
aware when you build the the Maricopa
County has very strict rules about dust
control so that's why there's a lot of
water used just to keep the dust down
just to be aware of that
um staff on the ditch issue I think
we're talking about the Reed Porter
project I'm guessing on on Price Road
will you get with our our you guys take
a look at that make sure that if they
damage that that's fixed it should be
their responsibility and also on parking
that's a rental that they're supposed to
be responsible keeping their parking on
their site so if you could take a look
at that as well the speed thing is the
speed thing's a problem in every
neighborhood in every city all through
Chandler that
um and your 91st streets in the county
so it have to be the sheriff's
department but if it's even in in the
orange tree neighborhood and you have
problems with speeder is the best thing
to do is get a hold of the beat Sergeant
it's a problem throughout City people
think they 35 or 45 doesn't mean 35 or
45 it means 60. so
um but I do appreciate the comments and
we'll have staff take a look at some of
those things you brought up though so
thank you anybody else
Mr Pugh if you'd like then to any
rebuttal or are you good
okay all right great with that I am
going to close the floor and any
comments from the commission
commissioner Lopez
yeah I'll go first and dress some um so
some of you may know this I am new to
Planning and Zoning but I did serve I
just finished up my uh eight years on
the Chandler city council so there's a
few things in here too wanna you know
elaborate more on
um some here on the dice and maybe some
afterwards so I'll address water first
again a lot of concerns were brought up
about water
um I can talk to you a lot afterwards
but Chandler is good with water when we
talk about the growth this is all
planned for we've got 100 Year water
assured water supply for Chandler so all
of this at 100 build up is part of that
calculation so our growth is already
built into that plus we have I think
it's 15
above and beyond even at 100 Year build
out so Water Wise were good but we
always have concerns so if you want to
learn more about it on how Chandler
deals with it I can speak with you
afterwards
um traffic as uh chair said about
speeding in and we all deal with it
especially around schools there's also a
way not just counting to police BB
contact Channel Tropic they can set up
traffic counters so they can see
speeding they can see counts and this is
how a lot of studies are done to
determine whether stop signs and or
street lights or other things would be I
need to altered in order to alter
traffic flow so if you do feel there's a
lot again a big problem with the
Speaking of boldness please contact our
traffic department and they can get some
meters out there and start tracking that
and I think it does speed also look for
staff nods if I don't know if it does
speeding it done no it does count but
I'm seeing nods that they also do check
speed so um and then that way if the
numbers are bad in one of our
neighborhoods by an elementary school is
real bad we want to uh posting a police
officer there consistently so that it
kind of slowed the traffic down so one
there uh and I don't know if the
applicant will not answer this or or
somebody from staff on the traffic also
timing of the study my assumption is
that since it was again this was
different than all the other previously
proposed
um uh recommendations are for the for
the build out here because those were
larger units I think there was more
count higher count the last time when it
came through Council on didn't go
um
that this was smaller so my assumption
is that it was a new traffic study for
this count that was done not one from
two or three years ago chairman uh
commissioner yes so uh not only do we we
had a reporters group submit a traffic
impact analysis uh we had this group
submit one as well
um we don't simply take their accounts
and then their estimations
um our traffic engineered then looks at
we we've been counting that I think
we've recently counted that road as well
and so she goes and looks at what they
said this will project to provide and
then measure that against what we
measured out in the field today so Bull
Moose we've honestly truly been looking
at this site for about four years and
it's been measured probably eight times
in that four years okay thank you so I
just want to make sure we had up-to-date
study
um and then irrigation ditch you know we
talked about maintenance and again I
remember some previous ones that come
through uh are you anyone who owns the
ditch who maintains the ditch
um again this seems to be out of the
purview of this case so ditch is
supposed to be maintained as it was from
previous owners nothing City and and the
uh the applicant are doing nothing to
maintain or modify the ditch is that
correct
okay so just wanted to clarify that so
as it was yesterday it is to be tomorrow
with the ditch okay
um
last bit uh again I want to thank you
all for coming out we had some Pro some
against uh I try to tell this to other
people that do come and spend take time
out of your own day to come out and deal
with city government so I understand it
can be frustrating
um but we do listen everybody on the
diocese we all live in these
neighborhoods we're going to be living
uh next door or even you know maybe even
down the street and use these streets
ourselves
um so we do consider your input we may
not agree with you on on where it may
end up or what in what side of the fence
it may land but don't please don't take
it as we are not listening and we don't
care but that we are having to evaluate
it from different perspectives as a
whole and as part of that again we're
just a recommending body to the council
the staff recommends to us we recommend
to the council and again this all ends
with the city council so uh if you feel
it doesn't go anywhere if you do feel it
goes your way and you don't want it to
change please do engage with the council
in next week when it comes before them
that's all I am thank you
any other comments
okay like that
um do we have a motion on the motion on
this case
I have to look it up now
hold on I'll I'll move for approval
okay thank you I get the right number
yeah that's why I made it I have it on
presentation right now so this is uh
yeah so I move for approval of the
rezoning preliminary development plan
and predominantly plot of
plh22-0018 and
pl222-0017 honeysuckle trail located at
the northwest corner of Warner Road and
bull news Drive approximately one half
mile west west of Dobson Road
okay do I have a second
I can't remember a second any further
comments on this
I I do want to uh commissioner Lopez I
almost said councilmember we serve
together uh commissioner Lopez's
comments um this is we are just
recommending body number one I I do want
to commend the applicant and staff I
mean this has been a long process this
is an eyesore in the area
um you know the challenges and you know
on traffic as we build out our city I've
been here 50 years you know when there
was no traffic I moved into I lived in
heatherbrook north of you guys
um back in the 80s when there was wasn't
a lot of traffic it's unfortunate that
people want to live in Phoenix I guess
it's a good and the bad
um traffic happens I think the impact on
this is 48 units it's pretty minimal but
it does clean up a situation that is an
eyesore
um we have another flood you know we
could have homes being damaged and
things like that so
um the reason I asked the question about
Charter Schools Charter Schools could
buy this property and there's not much
we could do and if you go by some of the
charter schools around the city you want
to see traffic it's insane so I think
this is a good use I think the Builder
has done a good job working with us this
is not something that happened the
meetings the two meetings versus one I
know there's been a lot uh Duane's in
the audience I know he's been in every
commission meeting and council meeting
forever working on this to make it a
better thing it's and we're not always
going to agree on stuff there's give us
and takes on all this kind of stuff but
I do support the project so with that
I'll share if I could sorry to hear
about
um I don't recall I'm drawn in blank did
we have additional stipulations read in
so we did have a stipulation that was
tweaked so if so I think the motion
needs to reference
commissioner Lopez in the second if you
want to allow him to just do that staff
do you want to just read read that and
that's the best way yeah so if I can
then just add that uh why don't we have
staff read read it in we'll do it that
way so it's an additional stipulation so
PDP stipulation number 11 the same
elevation and or floor plan shall not be
built side by side on Lots one through
eight backing to Warner Road okay so
yeah so uh motion 11 with Reddit
stipulations the second okay with that
right okay cool City attorney thank you
very much I appreciate that any other
comments
okay all those in favor of the project
say aye aye
aye any opposed motion carries
financially again we're recommending
body to the city council let's go uh
staff one is this going to council
for human uh this will be on the uh June
Thursday June 29th uh city council
meeting okay so to the audience you will
have an opportunity that time to go back
and from a council they make the final
decision on this we're just recommending
Bobby on it so thank you very much
okay any comments from staff a couple
things chairs so one of the residents
had brought up uh homeless and there is
actually a a hotline on the city's
website we've got a fantastic Community
Navigator group led by Missy geffsison
um and they're great at linking people
experiencing homelessness with the
services needed to get out of that just
wanted to out to the public what the
phone number is so it's
480-782-4302 is that Chandler cares line
I mean that will if you see somebody if
you see a group you see something that's
the number to call um and then they're
on it okay thank you very much I'm in
the uh the second thing I want to
mention uh a lot of people know and some
people don't but in the audience tonight
we've got Derek Horn uh and tonight is
actually going to be his last pz meeting
here as our director since we have we
won't be having the next pz meeting
before he formally retires from the city
of Chandler so he was a development
services director for five years we've
had the pleasure working with him for
five years uh when he entered we didn't
have anything regarding historic
preservation and in that time he created
the historic preservation ordinance and
he had the two items that went on the on
the agenda tonight uh that went for the
agenda item that went for tonight so I
just wanted to recognize Derek thank him
for five years uh
I I want to reiterate what Kevin said
Derek thank you very much
um you worked really hard a lot for the
city Your Love of uh historic stuff is
also great
um and next time you have to help make
sure staff knows it's Williams Field it
wasn't General Lord but thank you Joe
for your service I really do appreciate
it enjoy your retirement as well so
um we will not meet again until the
middle of July so wish everybody a very
happy Fourth of July celebration be be
safe and everybody have a great rest of
your night